Bloom Removal and Improved Melees

[Jewjitsu]

Well folks, it's official. DMR bloom will be removed in the TU, and melees have been fixed as well. watch and be amazed.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSrlaIJkm0M

I am soooo excited, can't believe it's actually real.

[Krod]

Link please.

[MidKnight]

........ ;)

[Jewjitsu]

do you not see the video? it was posted in 343's latest weekly update.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSrlaIJkm0M

[Krod]

Sorry not subscribed to them.

[Phrackture]

I find it wierd that the sniper blooms yet the DMR doesn't...

Edit: I know sniper bloom doesn't matter a whole lot I just find that wierd.

[TechSlayer]

I find it wierd that the sniper blooms yet the DMR doesn't...

Edit: I know sniper blood doesn't matter a whole lot I just find that wierd.

I noticed this as well. I was waiting for this dreaded player to pick up a pistol and show any improvements or changes to it, but he never shot one. -.-

[AZUL]

Not sure how i feel about this i feel like there was room it improve bloom and it didn't need to be removed but we will have to see how it plays out once its released.

[MidKnight]

my name is ROY, and ill 5 shot you everytime.
This isnt Halo 3, but you got 4 shotted all day.

[Benjak]

Wow! Maybe i will start playing the game again now that it's getting fixed

[Jewjitsu]

roy tweeted this stuff about how bloom takes skill. honestly i'm surprised. all i hear on his stream is how bad host is and bloom, and xbl, and all this crap. this update will fix that. i honestly think roy will be even better because his shot is so dang accurate. Don't worry Roy, you will still have the best DMR in the game!!

[D Moralize]

maybe there will be individual weapon settings for bloom, that would be cool and way more than I expected.

[Jewjitsu]

a lot of people think that the DMR is a 4 shot kill. it for sure has shield bleedthrough, if you're low enough shields (not no shields), one DMR headshot will kill you. i couldn't tell if 3 shots make your shields low enough tho. i think a four shot kill would be too overpowered, a 5 shot would be better.

[forefront]

It would be hilarious if bloom became a setting, and MLG decided to leave it in. I'd laugh.

[Jewjitsu]

not only would MLG lose players if they left bloom in, but they would miss out on the opportunity to get new players into the league by removing bloom. they might lose a few players by taking out bloom, but they would lose more by leaving it in IMO.

[Forbidd3n]

They should have fixed bloom, not take it out. If they would lessen the luck of headshots when u spam then bloom would widen the skill gap. Taking it out will lessen it.

[MichaelMongrel]

It's just too hard to make bloom work with xbox live. Off host you'll always be at an extreme disadvantage to a skilled host.

We can rejoice. 343 has made multiple steps in becoming more likeable than Bungie with this news.

[Eclipse]

I hate life.

[MichaelMongrel]

I hate life.

Did you just sell Reach or something?

[Eclipse]

Did you just sell Reach or something?

No, just....it happened so late....if only bungie wasn't such a fail

[Harrison.Greenhalgh]

You guys are aware that by taking out bloom the skill gap is almost completely gone. People complain about getting spamed now just wait now it will be all spams and you will have no chance at winning a battle if a player has shots on you first. This has confirmed my fears that this game is made so bad kids can feel good. The needle rifle was made seven shot kill because it had less bloom now what? Any one who uses the needle rifle is automaticly at a disadvantage. So halo will be based on who sees who first not skill.

[HEA7]

Wow! Maybe i will start playing the game again now that it's getting fixed

amen to that

[gwhit518]

I think with the compete removal of the bloom Halo is sneaking into CoD/CS territory and becoming more of a twitch shooter. When the player in the video picked up the bloom-less DMR he was melting everyone in front of him. With no pacing I think Reach will become a complete spam fest. This may actually speed up the game a bit because people will be able to kill quicker and the really good slaying teams will dominate but it may slow it down because your life is now basically diminished, I see Team Slayers becoming even more slow when we hit the Tied at 40 mark. Im really looking forward to MLG's new gametypes being released after the Title Update to see if they finish the season with the bloom or just go with the TU. Only time will tell.

[Jewjitsu]

the skill is being able to land every shot without a luck factor, just like the other halos, which were more fun to play than reach.

[HEA7]

the skill is being able to land every shot without a luck factor, just like the other halos, which were more fun to play than reach.

in halo 3, u had to follow ur shots since it was a 3 round burst. Harder to do than just 1 shot

[MichaelMongrel]

You may or may not like it, but at least it makes it fair for everyone now.

I'm tired of getting screwed over when I'm clearly "hitting" my shots, but they aren't registering. A player shouldn't think he just gRaped another player when in all reality he had host.

[AZUL]

I hope removing bloom is only an option and they find some way to balance the bloom or Reach will take very little skill in my opinion.

[DYNASTYBLUE2]

this is gonna be interesting when this happens either way im give it a shot

[Waterboy7]

I think I just wet my pants! OMG! Finally some one listen to their hard core fans.

I'm am actually going to go buy Reach again ;P

[DYNASTYBLUE2]

I think I just wet my pants! OMG! Finally some one listen to their hard core fans.

I'm am actually going to go buy Reach again ;P

lol waterboy

[Forbidd3n]

You may or may not like it, but at least it makes it fair for everyone now.

I'm tired of getting screwed over when I'm clearly "hitting" my shots, but they aren't registering. A player shouldn't think he just gRaped another player when in all reality he had host.


Thats connection, not bloom. Bloom was a great idea but Bungie didn't make it work right. And honestly if people want something to help the competitive community 343 needs to make dedicated servers since MLG wants to head more into online competition so that connection balances out.

[Antidote]

It seems to me with bloom removed all it's gonna result in doing is rewarding the player that gets the first shot off since now no one is capable of missing, with exception when shooting across the entire map.

Idk, I never wanted the bloom removed. However, I also don't feel removing bloom is going to save Reach so I'm not too concerned with it.

[Kingdayame]

We'll take OUR main stage back Starcraft.

[TLN Darkside]

Well at least 343 is trying to do something to help this game out, unlike Bungie who really doesn't care about any other playlist besides Action Sack. I am just not sure if this is going to bring Halo back like it used to. I think since the bloom was a good idea and just executed terribly by Bungie this is a step in the right direction. But I think what this game really needs are good competitive maps.

But at least next month I will have some kind of reason to get off League of Legends to try out the update.

[ZeroCool]

You may or may not like it, but at least it makes it fair for everyone now.

I'm tired of getting screwed over when I'm clearly "hitting" my shots, but they aren't registering. A player shouldn't think he just gRaped another player when in all reality he had host.

I completely agree. and it it seems like the bloom is a great idea if you are only playing on LAN 100% of the time but how many times does that actually happen for the average gamer? We all use XBL and the combination of a single shot dmr, bloom, and xbl just doesn't mix. something has to go and the only thing that can go is the bloom. I'm very excited to see how this improves the game...

and for everyone saying that the Bloom is such a good idea for reach...why is it that every other halo game for the past 10 years was awesome and now all of a sudden Halo sucks?

[Antidote]

and for everyone saying that the Bloom is such a good idea for reach...why is it that every other halo game for the past 10 years was awesome and now all of a sudden Halo sucks?

The maps lack several things that make them good for competitive playing.
The mechanics are just in general bad for a fast paced FPS that Halo is.
The matchmaking system took away what little there was for gaming competitively.
Halo is an older game, with new titles coming out constantly the game needs to always come out with something new and fresh to keep it intriguing. Halo Reach forgot to add that.

That's just a few of the reasons why.

Also for whoever stated that you can have your mainstage back from SC2. Trust me the removal of a bloom doesn't make Halo a better competitive game then SC2.

[phreekopath]

I wonder what the possibility is of MLG taking the damage down and making it a 6 shot kill, essentially nerfing the (nuke)rockets, snipe, and grenades as well.

I think it would almost be a necessity. 6 well placed shots will be more difficult than 5 well places shots, at least at distance or vs. a strafing player. A 5 shot spam across the map could easily take out a sniper or rocket guy before he knows where he's getting shot from, making these "power weapons" much less powerful since you die near instantly. A 6sk would give you that extra split second for a no-scope or some cover, and since these weapons already feel a bit OP and you would lessen their individual damage, I think it would bring a nice balance.

[DeeLuv]

Why do I get the feeling that the hardcore Starcraft people on this forum are, to say it mildly, less than enthusiastic about the fact that Halo Reach will be getting a boost in popularity from this update? It almost seems personal. LOL

You people do realize that TLN is run on the Halo platform right? That it won't ever be about Starcraft? I have no idea if TLN is in it for the long haul, or near extinction, but the only possible way for it to succeed is for Halo to succeed. Players are mightily excited about this update, and it really seems like Frank O'Conner "gets" Halo and MLG. 343 (which is composed of much of the original Halo CE and Halo 2 team) seems to be listening to the community in ways that Bungie in its later years never did.

Again, I have nothing AT ALL against Starcraft. I love the fact it is bringing a brand new market into MLG, and think that increased attendance and revenue streams into MLG will not only help Halo but ALL the games on the circuit.

[Antidote]

Why do I get the feeling that the hardcore Starcraft people on this forum are, to say it mildly, less than enthusiastic about the fact that Halo Reach will be getting a boost in popularity from this update? It almost seems personal. LOL

You people do realize that TLN is run on the Halo platform right? That it won't ever be about Starcraft? I have no idea if TLN is in it for the long haul, or near extinction, but the only possible way for it to succeed is for Halo to succeed. Players are mightily excited about this update, and it really seems like Frank O'Conner "gets" Halo and MLG. 343 (which is composed of much of the original Halo CE and Halo 2 team) seems to be listening to the community in ways that Bungie in its later years never did.

Again, I have nothing AT ALL against Starcraft. I love the fact it is bringing a brand new market into MLG, and think that increased attendance and revenue streams into MLG will not only help Halo but ALL the games on the circuit.

Actually the only SC2 lover that has been knocking the update as you put it has been me. I've also not been knocking it, I've been giving my opinion on it. I don't think a mere update is what Reach needs to be placed highly in a competitive stand point. Honestly I think we need a whole new game which is why I'm excited to see what Halo 4 brings in a competitive sense.'

As for TLN being only about Halo you're correct in that assumption and no one here has ever thought otherwise. I check in here personally from time to time simply because I have friends on the site and it's one of the very few sites I go to for Halo information. The other competitive games have plenty of other forums and fansite to go to. I've never been into TLN for the lans or the streams and what not. I'm just in it because it's basically a filter for the MLG forum. Both forums get the same info just this one it's easier to find the said info and has less flame wars.

No one joined these forums for other competitive titles trust me. I really can only think of 6 or 7 people on here that really know anything outside of competitive Halo enough to hold a serious conversation on the other competitive gaming titles. It's a Halo first forums but I still stand by my thoughts that Reach isn't made for true competitive gaming. Hopefully with a little luck and listening to feedback, then Halo 4 can be made correctly to fix this error.

[Brwn]

I wish they just brought the BR back, because that took skill to lead your shots, now people will just pull the trigger when the reticule is red and it will be first to shoot wins.


nerfing the (nuke)rockets, snipe, and grenades as well.
Are they really nerfing the sniper?

[DeeLuv]

Actually the only SC2 lover that has been knocking the update as you put it has been me. I've also not been knocking it, I've been giving my opinion on it. I don't think a mere update is what Reach needs to be placed highly in a competitive stand point. Honestly I think we need a whole new game which is why I'm excited to see what Halo 4 brings in a competitive sense.'

As for TLN being only about Halo you're correct in that assumption and no one here has ever thought otherwise. I check in here personally from time to time simply because I have friends on the site and it's one of the very few sites I go to for Halo information. The other competitive games have plenty of other forums and fansite to go to. I've never been into TLN for the lans or the streams and what not. I'm just in it because it's basically a filter for the MLG forum. Both forums get the same info just this one it's easier to find the said info and has less flame wars.

No one joined these forums for other competitive titles trust me. I really can only think of 6 or 7 people on here that really know anything outside of competitive Halo enough to hold a serious conversation on the other competitive gaming titles. It's a Halo first forums but I still stand by my thoughts that Reach isn't made for true competitive gaming. Hopefully with a little luck and listening to feedback, then Halo 4 can be made correctly to fix this error.

Fair enough. :)

I've enjoyed Reach FWIW, the 2 things that pissed me off the most - bloom inconsistency on Live/melee system - have been addressed and fixed. I am excited by the new classic maps, and think that 343 will be focused on making sure they make MLG quality original maps in the future. Halo 4 will be a fresh new start and will be epic, the updates to Reach and the involvement of Frank O'Connor on MLG's forums is a GREAT sign of things to come. As far as Reach not being a competitive game, one could argue that Instinct's current domination of the last two events puts a hole in that argument. If there wasn't a substantial skill gap between players and teams, a 42-1 record simply wouldn't be possible. Other teams are scrambling to catch up to them, and the "Can anyone beat Instinct?" storyline is one of the biggest in MLG going into Raleigh. I can't wait to watch!

[phreekopath]

Are they really nerfing the sniper?

No, that's not what I meant.

If MLG reduced player damage to effectively make the DMR a 6 shot kill, it would reduce the damage and area of effect for the sniper, grenades, and rockets as well. As far as I know, 343 is not touching the damage of any weapons.

[cF WiNGER]

I'm going to laugh when people turn their complaints to it being all spam and asking for bloom back. I personally can't wait to play without it so we can really see what kind of difference it makes.

My question is what will people find to use as an excuse for why they may not like the game now? After all, from reading a lot of forum threads people believe they are not at a pro level simply because of the bloom. LOL removing the bloom isn't going to make everybody an MLG Pro over night.

[MotoGP Fanatic]

FINALLY!!!!! 343I actually listened to its community unlike Bungie. More people hated the bloom then the ones who liked it, its smarter to listen to the majority then the minority. I cant wait till this patch happens, I'm finally going to ENJOY playing Reach. its been locked up in a box in my attic after about 2 months since its release, now I can dust it off and play Reach with my buds, since they too went MIA and play nothing buy MW2/BlackOPS.

[MotoGP Fanatic]

I'm going to laugh when people turn their complaints to it being all spam and asking for bloom back. I personally can't wait to play without it so we can really see what kind of difference it makes.

My question is what will people find to use as an excuse for why they may not like the game now? After all, from reading a lot of forum threads people believe they are not at a pro level simply because of the bloom. LOL removing the bloom isn't going to make everybody an MLG Pro over night.

your right about removing bloom isn't going to make anyone a pro automatically, BUT ppl spam on Reach bloom or no bloom they do it all the time. now the ones who dont have host have a more equal playing field than those who do have host. also the bloom makes a spam battle more about LUCK then skill. with bloom you can spam and get like 5 different results every time even if your aim is identical. some times I spam and kill the guy in 5 shots, and the next it only drains like half his shields, and even get a LUCKY head shot after aiming at his feet or knee!! now if you actually aim at his head and shoot quickly and get the head shot, guess what that was you and not LUCK or your super connection that did that.

I've played with host a few times which is extremely rare, but when I do have it I just run and shoot Halo2 style, spamming and shooting without a care in the world about ammo or aiming, and I'd get so many LUCKY head shots that to me are impossible to get with out host. more than half my kills where because of host and the others couldn't really damage me, they would pace their shots and I would just spam as fast as my DMR could shoot and win the battle, that doesn't mean I'm better just lucky and host. Now the non-host can spam and do actual damage to the host and out DMR him/her.

[Jewjitsu]

@phreek i think the DMR with the update will be a 4 shot because of bleedthrough. MLG might decide to lower damage to 90% and make the DMR a 5 shot, while also nerfing grenades, rockets, and snipe. that might be the best way to go about it, because i think the DMR as a 4 shot weapon is too much. 5 shot without bloom is perfect.

EDIT: i just tested a couple of settings, and the best way to do it is to put damage resistance on 110%. putting weapon damage on 90 makes it so that snipe headshots don't work. 110 damage resistance will make this game perfect, assuming the DMR becomes a 4sk

These settings are actually amazing. a direct grenade only pops your shields and takes away 1 block of health, as does a sniper body shot. rockets are nerfed perfectly, and direct plasmas still kill you. this is incredible, now i really can't wait for the update.

[phreekopath]

@phreek i think the DMR with the update will be a 4 shot because of bleedthrough. MLG might decide to lower damage to 90% and make the DMR a 5 shot, while also nerfing grenades, rockets, and snipe. that might be the best way to go about it, because i think the DMR as a 4 shot weapon is too much. 5 shot without bloom is perfect.

EDIT: i just tested a couple of settings, and the best way to do it is to put damage resistance on 110%. putting weapon damage on 90 makes it so that snipe headshots don't work. 110 damage resistance will make this game perfect, assuming the DMR becomes a 4sk

Essentially the same thing. I wasn't able to really see if there was any bleed through. I hope there is, and if so, I think you are right it would be a 4sk, but I still think even a 5 shot is going to be too fast/easy for top level players with above average aim, considering the low shot times the DMR is capable of. In terms of seconds, it will take less time to shoot 5 DMR shots than it did to shoot 4 BR shots in h3, I believe. Maybe they could take it down as far as 75%, if that wouldn't nerf the snipe/rocks/nades too much.

[Jewjitsu]

Essentially the same thing. I wasn't able to really see if there was any bleed through. I hope there is, and if so, I think you are right it would be a 4sk, but I still think even a 5 shot is going to be too fast/easy for top level players with above average aim, considering the low shot times the DMR is capable of. In terms of seconds, it will take less time to shoot 5 DMR shots than it did to shoot 4 BR shots in h3, I believe. Maybe they could take it down as far as 75%, if that wouldn't nerf the snipe/rocks/nades too much.
no, that would be so low that 1 snipe shot to the body wouldn't even pop your shields. honestly i think 110 damage resistance along with the bleedthrough/5sk dmr will make this game perfect.

[TuCrofty]

It seems to me with bloom removed all it's gonna result in doing is rewarding the player that gets the first shot off since now no one is capable of missing...

This makes no sense. People miss shots with bloom even when pacing. Just because bloom is going to be removed doesn't grant every player to perfectly 5 shot every time. It's like saying in Halo 2 every person to use the BR was able to land every burst. Your way of thinking is completely wrong. The only thing bloom did to this game was hurt it. Before Reach came out I was so excited about bloom because I figured the skill gap would increase greatly. But in reality all it did was allow players to spam their little hearts out and get lucky

[TripChee]

This makes no sense. People miss shots with bloom even when pacing. Just because bloom is going to be removed doesn't grant every player to perfectly 5 shot every time. It's like saying in Halo 2 every person to use the BR was able to land every burst. Your way of thinking is completely wrong. The only thing bloom did to this game was hurt it. Before Reach came out I was so excited about bloom because I figured the skill gap would increase greatly. But in reality all it did was allow players to spam their little hearts out and get lucky
i agree yo

[phreekopath]

no, that would be so low that 1 snipe shot to the body wouldn't even pop your shields. honestly i think 110 damage resistance along with the bleedthrough/5sk dmr will make this game perfect.

I haven't played with the custom settings too much in reach so the damage modifiers are pretty lost on me... maybe a 90% damage and a 110% resistance would equal a 6 shot without breaking the sniper...

either way, making those would balance a lot more than just the dmr... we'll see what direction mlg takes on it

[Jewjitsu]

idk, i just hope that KC knows that there is a big difference between adjusting weapon damage and damage resistance.

[EGOisSICK]

why not make bloom toggle-able?